Bungalow with Stairs album

[funkboy3]

So I'd like to start this post by apologizing for inadvertantly starting this storm of activity. I looked back and I believe I'm the first person to "complain" about the price.
The funny thing is, I never meant to really be complaining, but rather venting my personal frustrations at the overall situation.

I completely see both sides of the argument here. I can definitely respect an artists right to package and distribute their art however they see fit. As a matter of fact, that's part of what I find appealing about "bands" like Underworld (and perhaps in the old days New Order, OMD, etc). Exciting sleeves, experimental ideas, different delivery methods. These are all things I like and I'm really fine at the end of the day with artists limitting the method in which they release their work. Perhaps Messrs Hyde and Smith feel that "Bungalow" doesn't exist without "Dancing" and/or vice versa. I get that, I really do.

On the other hand, as a fan of Underworld's, I have a desire to experience as much of what they create as I possibly can. But the realities of the world restrict my access to said art sometimes. I couldn't just fly off to London to see the iTunes fest Roundhose gig. I had previous engagements that prevented me from making the short trek to San Francisco to hear UW in my neck of the woods. And, I couldn't afford the cost of flying to Tokyo to see Karl paint and hear/buy "Bungalow" at the actual event. So, I make due with what I can access when/if I can afford it.

So, in the specific case of the "Bungalow" release, all I was attempting to say when I triggered this whole thing off was: I'm bummed that my situation won't allow me to hear it. That came from the fact that I initially thought I'd never get a chance to hear it (since it was originally only going to be played/sold at the "Dancing" exhibition). Then I heard that they were going to sell the left overs, so I got hopeful. Then when it was released and I knew it was out of my price range, I got bummed. In particular, I was (and am) bummed that to have access to the music, I have to buy a catalog to an exhibit/event that I didn't go to. I'm sure its lovely, and I find Karl's art interesting. But, not having access to the one without the other is something I find personally frustrating as I could probably justify the price of one without the other. (Obviously, my place physically (the USofA) makes this even more difficult with the exchange rate.) As an additional aside: for the longest time, all the various channels (the "official" email newsletter included) said that the album was going to be offered up. So, all along I had it in my head that we'd see "Bungalow" released by itself, and when it wasn't that was disappointing.

I never said (and I never will say) "UW should give me their art in the way I want at the price I want." But, that doesn't mean I'm wrong or evil for wishing that it would've been released in a way that I could access it. Moreover, with a "official unoffical" forum like Dirty, it makes sense to me to express this thought out loud, as there's an implict assumption that UW or their minions might see this and have it inform their opinion about how they want to release their art in the future. It really doesn't seem that egregious to me that I have done this (as have others). And its absolutely flummoxing to me why some of the folks who were able to buy this release see it necessary to lambast those of us who were just innocently trying to express our desire to experience the same art.

Anyway, if you've gotten this far, congrats. I'm done with my dissertation. ;-)

[darktrain]

Originally Posted by funkboy3

The full length of it

Seconded. Amen 100% word for word.

[purlieu]

Originally Posted by funkboy3

Stuff.

Yes, this puts it far more eloquently than the silly argument BrotherLovesDub and I got into. I do think it's important to voice opinions and worries about the access of music they are offering to fans, especially somewhere that is read by the band and their associates. Maybe they'll read this and change things in the future, and I think that'll be worth all the bitching and baby crying and so on.

ThingInABook - I run a very tiny label and I've released records in far smaller runs than this was released in with large artwork booklets, sold them for £5 and made a profit, so I'm still not sure how justified the price is. Thanks for the description, Dirty0900, that does at least make it sound worth the money on some level. If I was a fan of Karl's art, I suppose the price might be a bit more sensible. I do wish they'd make the music available independently from the catalogue, though, especially considering that it evidently wasn't all recorded for the exhibition.

[TheBang]

Originally Posted by purlieu

I do wish they'd make the music available independently from the catalogue, though, especially considering that it evidently wasn't all recorded for the exhibition.

Rick was originally going to let Karl do his own thing for the exhibition, and not be involved, but Karl specifically asked Rick to put together this album from his ambient works for the exhibition.

[stimpee]

Originally Posted by purlieu

I run a very tiny label and I've released records in far smaller runs than this was released in with large artwork booklets, sold them for £5 and made a profit, so I'm still not sure how justified the price is.

I remember, I bought one from you once. Good stuff! Proper CD, proper colour card sleeve, a fiver. great value. I'm not saying this album should be a fiver but i see your example as a valid point.

[Bargo]

For anyone interested, it's back on sale at the shop. (and I caved in and ended up purchasing it)

[negative1]

Originally Posted by purlieu

Dirty0900, that does at least make it sound worth the money on some level. If I was a fan of Karl's art, I suppose the price might be a bit more sensible. I do wish they'd make the music available independently from the catalogue, though, especially considering that it evidently wasn't all recorded for the exhibition.

again, who is too decide whether every and all music that they
create will ever be released? and in what format?

just because it wasn't all recorded for the exhibition,
what difference does that make concerning it's status as
released for the exhbit only? [again i refer to earlier releases
like the anti-rom]

i'm sure there's a lot of licensing issues, and other things
involved with making a limited run of material available,
and the complexity of including and printing a book..

if you look back to the tokyo 3cd live concert, yeah it was too
bad that it only got released at that show... but maybe it was
a test run for the later series at liveherenow? and a few people
were fortunate enough to get extra copies from the band off ebay..

should they just never have released it?

anyways .. 'limited' is just that , a fixed amount made for a special
occasion.... i don't think this release, or dialogue should dissuade
them from doing further projects like this in the future...

---------------------------
in the end, they really can't win..

1) release something online only -> people complain that there isn't a physical release
(see riverrun series, alll the latest singles from 'barking')

2) release something physical only -> people complain that it isn't available digitally
(see the BWS album+book, tokyo 3xcd, underworld video compilations)

3) release something in vinyl only -> people complain that it isn't digital format
(some of the riverun singles, although most have been converted over now)

4) release something limited -> people complain about the price, and how hard it
is to get it, and in what formats etc... (the barking limited editions w/extra cd)

so looking at all the different combinations of how they could release something,
to make people 'happy'..

it boils down to releasing everything digitally, on vinyl, cd, and at a cheap cost..
which i just don't see happening anytime..

by the way, i'm not sure what arrangements bjork/depeche mode/pet shop boys
have... but they have been putting out a ton of singles, box sets, and all kinds of
other fancy formats of all the above for the last couple of albums... i'm sure they
have a larger audience, so that's something to take into account too..and also, their
limited editions are not 'cheap' either...

later
-1

[34958hq439-qjw9v5jq298v5j]

Originally Posted by negative1

it boils down to releasing everything digitally, on vinyl, cd, and at a cheap cost..
which i just don't see happening anytime..

I don't see why not. I mean, you really only need one physical format but really, how hard can it be to put this online for download. They have an online shop in place, it's just a matter of ripping the CD. I mean I really cannot see how it could take more than a few hours.

[negative1]

Originally Posted by 34958hq439-qjw9v5jq298v5j

I don't see why not. I mean, you really only need one physical format but really, how hard can it be to put this online for download. They have an online shop in place, it's just a matter of ripping the CD. I mean I really cannot see how it could take more than a few hours.

if it really was that easy, don't you think they would have
done it already?

did you miss the part about licensing, distribution,
the artists intent, etc. etc..

i used to help out with the website for the band KMFDM,
and it took them awhile to get online tracks, the online store,
and a lot of other things done.. i remember it was difficult from
a legal/license viewpoint to do a lot of things.. (especially the
artwork part , because they had to deal with the artist BRUTE separately)..

just because it's easy to do, doesn't mean
it's easy TO GET DONE...

there's a lot more factors involved..

later
-1

[lowbit]

Originally Posted by negative1

if [putting BwS up for sale digitally] really was that easy, don't you think they would have done it already?

Once you have decent infrastructure set up to put one item up for sale digitally, it's trivial to add more. And licensing etc shouldn't be a problem either, since it's their work and their sales outlet. I don't know why they haven't done it already, but yeah, it really is that easy.