how stupid are we???

Rog · #1 02-20-2009, 07:14 PM

come to the uk on a fake passport whoever you are and we'll give you everything......

...you brits know what i'm saying.....human rights?....fuckin shite....

and whats this 'british resident' shite?..........oooh, i visited the uk once afew years back so i'm british resident........fuck off

i'm fuckin fed up with all of this asylum seeker bollox

the only people who are benefiting from this are the fuckin lawyers. i'm sorry but its getting out of hand ....if you disagree thenlets talk about it

BeautifulBurnout · #2 02-21-2009, 03:23 AM

Rog You are completely wrong.

I am not even going to begin to tell you why because I will be here all day, and it won't make the blindest bit of difference.

Sean · #3 02-21-2009, 11:20 PM

Now you guys have gotten me curious.

chuck · #4 02-22-2009, 02:05 AM

I married a woman from Norn Iron. In Belfast.

Then moved back to NZ. Have been here since 2003.

Once we've been married 7 years, I almost auto-magically get British residency. But I don't think I get the passport. Would love to raise the child here in NZ, then come back to UK/Europe for experiencing the old world - when it's teenaged - and I can walk to the Tate and hang out - or wander down the South Bank looking at old books together.

Don't know if I'll ever take up a UK passport though - my child will have the option - the missus has kept hers, but has NZ residency.

Or maybe I'm not the type of resident-seeker that Rog is referring too.

BeautifulBurnout · #5 02-22-2009, 03:18 AM

Sean

I think Rog was prolly drunk when he posted this - and I think he is talking about Binyam Mohamed being released from Guantanamo and returned to the UK.

But he has some basic facts wrong - he didn't arrive in the UK on a fake passport, but at the age of 15 with his family as an asylum seeker. Although his asylum claim (or rather his family's asylum claim) failed, he was given Exceptional Leave to Remain in the UK for a period of 4 years, after which - provided you keep your nose clean - it becomes Indefinite Leave to Remain and thereafter you can apply for citizenship should you want it.

For whatever reason, in 2001 he decided to go to Afghanistan - he had recently converted to Islam. For whatever reason, he then went over the border into Pakistan. For whatever reason, instead of using his Convention travel documents (as a refugee he would not have had a passport and would have had to use temporary travel documents to leave and enter the UK) he decided to try and use a friend's passport to leave Pakistan for his return journey.

He was picked up by the Pakistani authorities and rendered first to Afghanistan, then Morocco and was held as an enemy combattant (I presume) in "black sites" and tortured. He was then rendered to Guantanamo in 04 and has been there since.

He is supposed to have admitted to researching the preparation of a "dirty bomb" on the basis of a satirical website set up in 1979 by Barbara Ehrenreich and others. It is alleged that he was tortured by having small cuts made to his genitals, amongst other things.

Charges were never brought against him. He is one of the 5 people whose cases were so appallingly bad that it led to the resignation of Military Prosector Darrel Vandeveld in disgust at the whole process.

Prior to his release, Binyam Mohamed's military-appointed defence lawyer Yvonne Bradley was trying to secure the release of documents which were deemed vital to the defence case, which apparently not only prove that torture took place, but also show British M15 involvement in interrogating him in the "black sites". An application to the High Court led to a ruling in which David Milliband, the British Foreign Secretary, alleged that the release of the documents would mean that there would be a breakdown in co-operation on intelligence between the UK and the US and produced a letter confirming this threat from the US. The Judges reluctantly had to concede that it was not in the interests of national security to release said documents, and thus ruled against their release.

What Milliband had neglected to mention, however, was that it was the Foreign Office that solicited the letter from the US in the first place - in other words, they created their own evidence to cover their own arses. Our government have been complicit in this man's torture and a government minister has perverted the course of justice at best and committed perjury at worst. Has he been arrested? Of course not.

And as if by magic, Binyam Mohamed is now to be released and returned to the UK in the vain hope that the question of British collusion in the torture of a person to whom we had offered refugee protection will go away. And all the right-wing nutters, tabloid consumers and, I am sorry to say, even Rog, are all saying that this man is a terrorist and shouldn't be allowed back in the UK on the basis of allegations made as a result of "confessions" obtained from torture where charges were eventually never even laid, where the British government were involved in that torture, and where the Prosecutor was so disgusted with the whole process that he resigned. Guilty until proven innocent, as always.

On the other hand, I could be completely wrong, and Rog is complaining about an immigrant family who has moved into his house, taken his job off him and got his daughter pregnant.... but I doubt it.

Deckard · #6 02-22-2009, 04:23 AM

That's as good an explanation as I've read BB, thanks for that.

I wondered if that was what Rog was referring to.

Rog don't go getting all Daily Mail on us now, will you? I'll whip your arse...
(on the other hand, feel free to elaborate if you've been misunderestimated

)

Chuck - seeking asylum from a shortage of old books and decent galleries - that's a good 'un.....

Sean · #7 02-22-2009, 10:04 AM

Ah...thanks for elaborating - both about the story and about Rog's lack of sobriety.

I can totally understand why the actions of Mohamed could raise some suspicions, travelling with another person's passport after wandering the Afghanistan/Pakistani border, but doing what they've done according to your telling of it is completely unjustified. I'm so glad we're making a clear turn away from indefinite incarceration and torture with the new President.

sola sistim · #8 02-23-2009, 01:14 AM

oi, i been to da uk, can i get a residency rog?

lolol

Rog · #9 02-25-2009, 06:16 AM

i was drunk when i posted the above which is far too ranty. i wqas refering to 'bin laden's right hand in europe' who is STILL hanging on here and the other 8 or 9 who should not be in our country. They could have left prison anytime if they left the country. The other fellow referred to who released last week has only very tenuous ties to the uk and has not been a 'british resident' for a number of years. Now, 'for whatever reason he went to afghanistan' -the reason he gave for being in afghanistan was to 'kick his heroin addiction' which to me is like buggering off to columbia to kick your coke habit or down the pub to kick your alcohol habit.....it just don't follow. 'He decided to use anothers passport to try and enter the uk' - why would anyone who had nothing to hide try such a thing? I don't think his motivations are as inocent as you seem to think. However, i would not EVER condone torture at any time or being held without trial and he should have been tried or released a long time ago along with many others. The thing i ask is why does he want to come back here? this is not his home nor ever has been.....

BeautifulBurnout · #10 02-25-2009, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rog

i was drunk when i posted the above which is far too ranty. i wqas refering to 'bin laden's right hand in europe' who is STILL hanging on here and the other 8 or 9 who should not be in our country. They could have left prison anytime if they left the country. The other fellow referred to who released last week has only very tenuous ties to the uk and has not been a 'british resident' for a number of years. Now, 'for whatever reason he went to afghanistan' -the reason he gave for being in afghanistan was to 'kick his heroin addiction' which to me is like buggering off to columbia to kick your coke habit or down the pub to kick your alcohol habit.....it just don't follow. 'He decided to use anothers passport to try and enter the uk' - why would anyone who had nothing to hide try such a thing? I don't think his motivations are as inocent as you seem to think. However, i would not EVER condone torture at any time or being held without trial and he should have been tried or released a long time ago along with many others. The thing i ask is why does he want to come back here? this is not his home nor ever has been.....

Has it ever occurred to you why they want Binyam Mohamed here? I bet he knows something that would be very damaging to our govt. and they want him to stfu, personally...

(It was his home between the ages of 15 and 23, though, in all fairness.)