parah salin?

[cacophony]

i wonder how independent the independent vote really is. we're all speculating about whether this selection will really win or lose voters but i'm not sure it makes a huge difference in the end. it seems like most people tend to lean one way or another, and ultimately once people are in the booth i'm not sure they really stray from their initial gut reaction.

think about how low bush's approval rating was in the last election. but when it really came down to it people started saying, "eh, i don't know if we should change horses mid-stream." it wasn't so much the issues or the record of performance.

in the end i think the extreme right-wingers were never really a risk. and for obama the clinton backers were never really a risk. come election day people are going to root for their team the way they always do. i don't think palin is going to make or break this campaign because ultimately the majority of people aren't going to cross party lines once they're sealed in the voting booth. it's going to be, "this isn't my first choice but it's better than voting for that other guy."

[dubman]

Originally Posted by cacophony

i wonder how independent the independent vote really is. we're all speculating about whether this selection will really win or lose voters but i'm not sure it makes a huge difference in the end. it seems like most people tend to lean one way or another, and ultimately once people are in the booth i'm not sure they really stray from their initial gut reaction.

think about how low bush's approval rating was in the last election. but when it really came down to it people started saying, "eh, i don't know if we should change horses mid-stream." it wasn't so much the issues or the record of performance.

in the end i think the extreme right-wingers were never really a risk. and for obama the clinton backers were never really a risk. come election day people are going to root for their team the way they always do. i don't think palin is going to make or break this campaign because ultimately the majority of people aren't going to cross party lines once they're sealed in the voting booth. it's going to be, "this isn't my first choice but it's better than voting for that other guy."

i agree, like, 7000% with his post. people are already basically in their slots by now, though i get the impression it took much longer than usual. still, things are set, and the only danger with this is that mccain might have actually pissed a few people off with this stunt. but the only thing swinging anyone at this point are the major embarassments that managers point out to days, months, or several years after the election and say "thats what started to/finally/outright killed it." losing candidates commonly have that moment where they reach a certain pinnacle of goofiness and do something that makes the well-maybe-i-would vote swing towards their base instinct.
if this happens to obama we might see it in the debates. if mccain loses (something i still think is an 80% certainty) it will be the palin pick.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by cacophony

i wonder how independent the independent vote really is. we're all speculating about whether this selection will really win or lose voters but i'm not sure it makes a huge difference in the end. it seems like most people tend to lean one way or another, and ultimately once people are in the booth i'm not sure they really stray from their initial gut reaction.

Speaking as a registered independent, I can say that Palin's extreme positions are extremely off-putting. For instance, I recognize the value of teaching abstinence, but not at the exclusion of sex education. And I have mixed feelings on the right to bear arms in that there are realistic reasons to need a gun for people living in certain areas of the country, but I'm not pleased to see video of Palin enjoying machine gun target practice. So I tend to think that McCain's behavior as of late (and VP choice) will be concerning to many center-leaning independents, and that he's probably driving many of them to Obama's camp.

[cacophony]

but honestly, haven't you been leaning more towards obama than mccain this whole time?

[Sean]

Originally Posted by cacophony

but honestly, haven't you been leaning more towards obama than mccain this whole time?

Absolutely. But setting aside the Presidential candidates and looking at the VP picks on their own merits - specifically as the folks who'll have to step up if something happens to the President - I find Biden a far more desirable alternative to Palin.

Originally Posted by Deckard

Palin in a talk to the church congregation on the Iraq War:

"[Pray] for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God....That's what we have to make sure that we're praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God's plan."


Palin, in supporting a $30 billion Alaskan national gas pipeline project:

"I think God's will has to be done in unifying people and companies to get that gas line built, so pray for that."


Exactly the kind of "thinking" the world could do without right now.

Ugh. And as an atheist, I'm getting sick of all the "God bless America" talk at the end of every single speech, both Republican and Democratic. Everyone's seeing who can out-god each other.

[cacophony]

well it's working on someone. because my hyper-religious texan in-laws have suddenly burst into a flurry of "why god is awesome" spam emails. it's an increase of fervor that's picked up just since this weekend.

i received one today explaining how different vegetables resemble different parts of the human body, and thus proves intelligent design. did you know the cross-section of a carrot looks like the human eye??

that's when i hit "delete."

[mmm skyscraper]

Originally Posted by cacophony

well it's working on someone. because my hyper-religious texan in-laws have suddenly burst into a flurry of "why god is awesome" spam emails. it's an increase of fervor that's picked up just since this weekend.

i received one today explaining how different vegetables resemble different parts of the human body, and thus proves intelligent design. did you know the cross-section of a carrot looks like the human eye??

that's when i hit "delete."

That's when i hit "delete."

That's when it all gets blown away

That's when i hit "delete."

The spirit fights to find its way

[gambit]

"Dear God, please let that $30 billion gas pipeline project go through so my hubby can make more money. I need more money to buy more guns to shoot those godless mooses. Of course, if it is your will."