Underworld in Writing

[Dunwho]

Some of you may remember nearly a year ago I was talking about a dissertation I was going to write for my final year studying Art History and Underworld was going to be part of that dissertation. Well that time has come and I am, after months of research and preparation now writing the damn thing and I have gotten down to the nitty gritty stuff that I am going to need a few dirts to help me out on...

...y'know the kinds of things that I know some people really pride themselves on knowing and looking into... Dates, Names, Artists, Writers etc etc...

While I am pretty set on most things there are a few specifics I will need some help to clear up and get right ......

So I hope you can all help!

First things first.. anybody know where i could find the slow motion video of the "Ball Drop" recorded by one of the tomato team and displayed at their New York art Jam and was on UWLive.com for some time....is it around? Did someone download it somehow? Can I get a copy of it?

Secondly: On youtube there is a video of Cherry Pie recorded off MTV sometime around 1996/97 .... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0i5OOBMNlJI&feature=related this is the video.... does anyone have a specific date??
....Furthermore would I be right in thinking that the video itself is probably older than the music as It was originally used as a video for Rez??


This is the sort of thing I am going to be asking over the next few weeks... if it interests you Id love your help! PM me if you think you can help a bit more...

I am also still looking for any articles that refer specifically to the UW/Tomato link and the ideas/technologies behind the UnderworldLive team..

Thanks!

Dave

[TheBang]

First things first.. anybody know where i could find the slow motion video of the "Ball Drop" recorded by one of the tomato team and displayed at their New York art Jam and was on UWLive.com for some time....is it around? Did someone download it somehow? Can I get a copy of it?
It's currently offline. Used to be on the Art Jam page (currently "coming soon"). I have a copy that I haven't processed yet. I'll see if I can get that done for you.

Secondly: On youtube there is a video of Cherry Pie recorded off MTV sometime around 1996/97 .... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0i5OOBMNlJI&feature=related this is the video.... does anyone have a specific date??
....Furthermore would I be right in thinking that the video itself is probably older than the music as It was originally used as a video for Rez??
I don't think that video is real. I think this guy just took the Rez footage, and set it to "Cherry Pie" music. The same guy did the same thing for "Crocodile" before the official Croc video came out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGe5f5CbXcU

Just look at that guy's YouTube channel. He's done it for all kinds of songs, mixing and matching the music and videos.

[Dunwho]

It's currently offline. Used to be on the Art Jam page (currently "coming soon"). I have a copy that I haven't processed yet. I'll see if I can get that done for you.

That would be amazing, thanks so much, I have about a month before I need to get visual material finalised.. I wish there was something i could give in return.


I don't think that video is real. I think this guy just took the Rez footage, and set it to "Cherry Pie" music. The same guy did the same thing for "Crocodile" before the official Croc video came out:



Yea I didnt want to say because I amn't sure about what they had released around that time... but i was definitely sceptical... it is about as helpful knowing that that isnt a legit video actually.. thanks for that!

[TheBang]

Here's a fairly complete list of music videos, if that helps any:

http://www.borndirty.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10969

Also, that Slow Bells balloon drop video you requested was done by Toby Vogel, not Tomato. I'm not sure if that makes a difference to your project.

[big screen satellite]

not sure if you seen these posters http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigscreensatellite/5081537570/in/set-72157618324933591/

click forward from this one, to view them (the entire set is for sale if anyone is interested)

basically its Tomato / Underworld live from the late 1990's 16 pictures (1 picture missing though for some reason....will try and reupload it)

this one particularly tomato relevant: http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigscreensatellite/5080949083/in/set-72157618324933591/

finally, of interest after these pictures is a rare Calendar / Letter graphically doodled by Karl Hyde in 1984... not necessarily of value to the project you're on but neat for any fans of Karl's doodling from a by-gone era! (also for sale if interested!)

[Dunwho]

Also, that Slow Bells balloon drop video you requested was done by Toby Vogel, not Tomato. I'm not sure if that makes a difference to your project.

Well I was primarily looking for this video because It was a high quality video showing how they have extended out into the crowd the surface onto which the images are projected... and also animated that surface by having the balls bounce above the audience.

I have a decent hand held camera video from uwlive account on youtube of the same thing but the sound isnt great on it. Toby used a track by Rick i think for the video here and it has no sound from the real performance.. and it is slowed down in places, but like I said i am looking for clarity of image in order to demonstrate my point first and foremost.

On the Toby Vogel thing, I am treating the Underworld Live show as the work of a Live team. The art direction of the shows, the video materials, the lighting and the music/performance, and even Karls dancing (and at times specific costume).. are all co-ordinated by the underworldlive team.. and many key figures and ideas within that team are Tomato ideas and from Tomato members. Toby has worked with UW since the start of the 90s and his input on the show has become elemental.. so even though he is not a member of Tomato (officially speaking - at least to my knowledge) he is intrinsic in synthesising the different Tomato works and ideas that are part of an UWlive show (Just like Hadyn Cruickshank and his company Coloursound Experiment)

Sorry once you get me in writing mode I cant control myself... Ill stop being so serious now.

Thanks for the list of videos... Got most of them I think, I am going to have to clarify dates and authors for most of them when it comes to crediting each one.. but that will come in time.

[Andrea]

...
finally, of interest after these pictures is a rare Calendar / Letter graphically doodled by Karl Hyde in 1984... not necessarily of value to the project you're on but neat for any fans of Karl's doodling from a by-gone era! (also for sale if interested!)

The Calendar is awesome http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigscreensatellite/5370461874/in/set-72157618324933591/

If my name was Helen I would pay a lot for it :D
No, I´m not kidding. Its´so beautiful so it almost hurts.

Do you know who Helen is btw? I have seen similar "Helen" letters previously so I´m just curious.

[Champiness]

On the Toby Vogel thing, I am treating the Underworld Live show as the work of a Live team. The art direction of the shows, the video materials, the lighting and the music/performance, and even Karls dancing (and at times specific costume) are all co-ordinated by the underworldlive team.. and many key figures and ideas within that team are Tomato ideas and from Tomato members.

What is this in reference to? The only thing I can think of is this one video I saw of Moaner where Karl had a pink dress on.

[big screen satellite]

The Calendar is awesome http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigscreensatellite/5370461874/in/set-72157618324933591/

If my name was Helen I would pay a lot for it :D
No, I´m not kidding. Its´so beautiful so it almost hurts.

Do you know who Helen is btw? I have seen similar "Helen" letters previously so I´m just curious.

yes i do, she sent me all of her Underworld stuff as she knew i was a big fan (i paid for it!), she was a fan back from the Freur days and used to write to Karl very regularly, she met them a few times and used to call him up for chats on the phone, i have transcripts of calls she made!!! (she was more of a 'stalker' than normal fans!!). She got on obvioulsy very well with Karl back then and the Uw team used to write to her about gigs, and send her stuff...

its a nice bit of fan corresepondence...

[TheBang]

Oh, I forgot I already processed the Slow Bells video. It's in the Beautiful Burnout ArtJam torrent on RTSR, but I've also uploaded it here now:

http://www.mediafire.com/?bwbgy1j55hw0i20

[joethelion]

What is this in reference to? The only thing I can think of is this one video I saw of Moaner where Karl had a pink dress on.


well - I think what he means is...

if you look back, Karl did have kind of a "costume" specific to each tour (although he wasn't really wearing anything too "costumey" like say... PopMart era U2)

I can't remember each of them off-hand, but like - the "disco ball" style shirt during the OWB tour...

oh - and there was the performance (forget when/where - but I want to say it was in Japan) where Karl came out in a wedding dress

...and he does always wear shell-toe Adidas

[Andrea]

yes i do, she sent me all of her Underworld stuff as she knew i was a big fan (i paid for it!), she was a fan back from the Freur days and used to write to Karl very regularly, she met them a few times and used to call him up for chats on the phone, i have transcripts of calls she made!!! (she was more of a 'stalker' than normal fans!!). She got on obvioulsy very well with Karl back then and the Uw team used to write to her about gigs, and send her stuff...

its a nice bit of fan corresepondence...

Oh, I see! But I must say, if I had private letters like that from a band I like I would never sell it, never ever!

[Dunwho]

What is this in reference to? The only thing I can think of is this one video I saw of Moaner where Karl had a pink dress on.

Yea well in fact the big wedding dress is not one that I am going to go near because IF it had a meaning then itd certainly be something very conceptual or surrealist or something...

But what I am talking about is what Joethelion was saying, that I feel Karl's choice of clothing has complimented the aesthetic of the show over the years.

For instance if we are to look at the shiney reflective jacket he used in the OWB tour he would use the handheld camera looking in real close to the mirrors on the jacket creating an abstract effect on the big screen as he danced and moved. .. thats just one example.

His black and white striped shirt is worth looking at too i feel especially in relation to a lot of the visuals they were using around that time.. and why he may have started wearing it again on the recent tour.

But im not going to get too bogged down on clothing.. this study is about the show as a whole.

anybody's views on this would be cool to hear though

[TheBang]

I believe the wedding dress was due to a lost bet.

[Dunwho]

Oh, I forgot I already processed the Slow Bells video. It's in the Beautiful Burnout ArtJam torrent on RTSR, but I've also uploaded it here now:

http://www.mediafire.com/?bwbgy1j55hw0i20

Thankyou so so much for this!

I believe the wedding dress was due to a lost bet.

That makes a whole load of sense!

[Dunwho]

Wooo! Just got the go ahead to pretty much focus the whole dissertation on Tomato and the UnderworldLive Show as a platform for looking at the development of Visual Music in Audio Visual Art!

It took ages to convince them that what I had was worth doing and they have finally let me at it!

So happy!

Thanks to everyone who has been helping so far and emailing me on the side, I will definitely be needing more help in the future... you will get an acknowledgement! ;)

[Dunwho]

Question: The "wheel of Light" used by Cruickshank at the Oblivion Ball in Japan... was it/or has it ever been used anywhere else??

Check it out here... http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1122907677752&oid=21193697848

Thanks to Todd for this video.. nice work!

[ThingInABook]

I believe the wedding dress was due to a lost bet.

i think we had this topic on the chat some weeks ago. i read somewhere that the dress was called 'oblivion ball dress' and he used it cos he needed something fancy to wear at the oblivion ball, since it was, well, a ball.

oh, dunwho, i've a tomato gasbook at home (it's a large format book with tons of pictures, including an exhibition in spain). do you want some images of it?

[Dunwho]

do you want some images of it?

DO I!?!?!? That would be fantastic! What was the title of the exhibition? Just so I can look it up.

If there was an introduction essay or a forward to the exhibition catalogue or anything that would be the most valuable thing to me.

But photos would be great!! Thanks everyone for being so helpful. I am really overwhelmed!

[TheBang]

If you're interested in buying the Tomato Gas Book, there are some cheap used ones here (including a UK seller):

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/4860831853/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

If you want to buy it new, these guys still have some:

http://www.zakkacorp.com/display.php?sku=gastomato&header=search_results&magazine=gasbook

If you also want the Tomato Gas DVD (Onyx Pearls), they also have that:

http://www.zakkacorp.com/display.php?sku=gasdvd19&header=search_results&magazine=gasdvd

[ThingInABook]

DO I!?!?!? That would be fantastic! What was the title of the exhibition? Just so I can look it up.

If there was an introduction essay or a forward to the exhibition catalogue or anything that would be the most valuable thing to me.

But photos would be great!! Thanks everyone for being so helpful. I am really overwhelmed!

i've some pics in my old photobucket account. will try to scan it next week.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0527.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0528.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0529.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0530.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0531.jpg

this is the only pic i took from the exhibition. it had loads of chalk everywhere. i believe it took place in spain:

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0532.jpg

and thanks thebang for looking it in amazon! it's such a nice album book thing. lovely pictures everywhere :)

[Dunwho]

If you're interested in buying the Tomato Gas Book, there are some cheap used ones here (including a UK seller):

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/4860831853/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

If you want to buy it new, these guys still have some:

http://www.zakkacorp.com/display.php?sku=gastomato&header=search_results&magazine=gasbook

If you also want the Tomato Gas DVD (Onyx Pearls), they also have that:

http://www.zakkacorp.com/display.php?sku=gasdvd19&header=search_results&magazine=gasdvd

Oh cool! Yea Mike was good enough to send me the DVD a while back.. I must get that back to him soon!!!!

I can imagine the book is a wealth of material. ... might get my hands on one of those used copies! Thanks for the heads up on this book guys! The pics look great thinginabook! Thanks

[Dunwho]

i've some pics in my old photobucket account. will try to scan it next week.



http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0528.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0529.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0530.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/vectorweapon/DSCF0531.jpg

this is the only pic i took from the exhibition. it had loads of chalk everywhere. i believe it took place in spain:


and thanks thebang for looking it in amazon! it's such a nice album book thing. lovely pictures everywhere :)

Wow thanks so much for this!! Is there anything written in the book itself? Like by any members about Tomato?? Anything at all would be great, because while I have loads of interviews and stuff there is not a whole lot in print about them, either written by them or by others... so anything is sooooper helpful!

[ThingInABook]

i remember that it features a scketchbook ('youniverse'), some prints, photos, tycho's nova book, digital graphics and some exhibition pics. there isn't much text, it's just a big, lovely tomato flipbook.

[Dunwho]

Hey guys... ok I have another request.

This is one that everyone could benefit from though.

I am looking for the video feed of the Cocoon gig from December 2006. I believe the visuals are well worth seeing!

Is there anyone out there with this locked up somewhere in their hard drive??? or is there an archive online... or even some youtube footage..

Id love to see it!

[big screen satellite]

Hey guys... ok I have another request.

This is one that everyone could benefit from though.

I am looking for the video feed of the Cocoon gig from December 2006. I believe the visuals are well worth seeing!

Is there anyone out there with this locked up somewhere in their hard drive??? or is there an archive online... or even some youtube footage..

Id love to see it!


all my visuals of this are in my head - sorry ;)

[Dunwho]

all my visuals of this are in my head - sorry ;)

Ha no worries... ive got so much to work with anyway Im going to have to draw the line somewhere!