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#161
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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And to take it a step further, of course gay people who support gay marriage are in it to suit their personal desires. They don't want to be discriminated against! Do they consider the affect on society? Who knows, but in my personal opinion, bigotry-based discrimination has never been good for society, so the pro-same sex marriage crowd has a far more stable logic-platform to stand on than the cons do.
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#162
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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Sure, on a broad level, people will acknowledge that defeating discrimination is good for society, but you know I'm not sure that's the principle thinking of those who support it. I think it's more realistic to say that there are: (a) those who argue against it because they feel it's sinful or bad for society (b) the rest who quite simply see no problem with it, and - in the absence of a convincing argument to oppose it - are generous enough to consider those of us who don't have that right. Really, I don't see any great movement of people supporting it because they think gay marriage will somehow benefit society. But then I've yet to see a single convincing argument against gay marriage that wasn't rooted in religion (or similarly woolly notions of a natural order or cosmic intention or whatever). |
#163
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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Your last example is so incredibly illogical as to be laughable. But I'm going to argue it, just so that you can't come back and say that I didn't. Theme park rides are designed for normal sized adults because there are exponentially more normal sized adults than there are little people. It's economics, Holmes. There is no way to make an average theme park ride safe enough for for a little person to ride, and there is no way to build a viable business out of a theme park designed for little people. The process of mechanical, electrical, and structural engineering that goes in to these places, not to mention marketing, food, park attendants, etc makes a theme park one of the most financially nightmarish operations outside of Las Vegas. Your example simply could not exist in reality. I'm fairly certain that Stephen Hawking proved this somewhere. And if I sound condescending or insulting, I'm very tired. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the quality of your arguments...
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You dodged a massive fucking bullet, man. The really huge Super Mario kind with the eyes on the side, where you had to run and duck into the little divot to avoid shrinking. You did that. You got into that divot, and you're still super sized, and you can break blocks with your face. Now get out there and step on some fucking turtles!! Last edited by Sarcasmo; 07-21-2009 at 08:23 PM. |
#164
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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really that was just fucking retarded. |
#165
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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Maybe because I'm from Wisconsin, but I have honestly never heard the "Adam and Steve" argument used as anything other than sarcasm. The point of the argument is that pretty much everyone is biased, not just the bigots and hateful. It's in response to this thread's general attitude which seems to be that the anti-gay marriage people don't just dislike the idea but are also homophobic, bigoted, hateful people. It is not the argument that I dislike. I don't see anything wrong with same sex marriage personally. But honestly I would be afraid to ever argue against it because no matter *what* argument I come up with I would be called hateful. Same as arguing against affirmative action. I don't see it as stripping them of their "basic civil rights". They can still get married, it just has to be someone of the opposite gender. I don't wanna argue the file sharing thing, because my point is that it was ambigious. You think it hurts you, fine. Mike Doughty claims that he'd be flat broke if not for it. Could be argued either way, and I'd wager that most arguments made on the topic are biased in some way. |
#166
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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That it's a slippery slope? |
#167
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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Then go and cry about it...for the love of god do not attempt to refute it |
#168
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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"I don't see it as stripping them of their 'basic civil rights'. They can still get married, it just has to be someone of the same color." I assume it's clear why that's a limitation of basic civil rights, yes? And as far as I can tell, it's pretty obvious how these two cases are extremely similar. If they're not to you, then I'm happy to discuss it further. Quote:
But subject matter aside, your focus on "bias" seems to run throughout all of these topics to an unusual level. While we certainly need to recognize where bias enters into all of this, it simply doesn't disprove or counter things like facts, or real-world consequences. My personal "bias" has led me to assert that file-sharing, when used irresponsibly, has hurt many smaller artists, but that doesn't remove the "fact" that it actually has. And your personal "bias" has led you to claim that gay people "can still get married, it just has to be someone of the opposite gender", but that doesn't change the "fact" that gay couples who want to marry have had the legal benefits that are afforded to straight married couples stripped away from them through legislation like prop 8. "Bias" only excuses just so much stuff before it becomes irrelevant.
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Download all my remixes Last edited by Sean; 07-22-2009 at 11:24 AM. |
#169
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
well no, that'd be taking you seriously
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#170
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Re: is there anyone else who is pro-life AND pro-gay rights, or is it just me?
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As for the rest; I don't have much to argue about there. I'm not saying there isn't some kind of bigotry out there, I'm just saying that assuming that ALL opposers to your point of view are bigots is pretty unfair. |
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