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#41
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Re: Arizona - WTF?
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You have a valid point that there are bigger fish to fry, but why argue this at all then? Quote:
Again, I'd really wait to see how this was actually enforced before saying America is headed for collapse as a direct result of this law (or whatever). I would bet dollars to donuts that nearly everyone is overreacting. |
#42
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Re: Arizona - WTF?
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Secondly, despite insistence to the contrary by supporters of SB1070, this bill does NOT mirror federal law. The two stipulations I highlighted above about "reasonable suspicion" and citizens being able to sue cops that they don't feel are being stringent enough, are both unique to Arizona's bill. And beyond that, they are precisely what will be most destructive to the basic civil rights of American citizens of Mexican heritage. Lastly, your statement declaring "the fact that we're averaging one kidnapping per day in this state" is a bit misleading in that it seems to imply that random illegal immigrants are coming into the United States and kidnapping random U.S. citizens. But according to what I've seen and heard, the issue is all thanks to the drug cartels dealing with collection issues and such through kidnappings of those who owe them money. And beyond that, many of the people who are kidnapping victims in Arizona are actually illegal immigrants who are then ransomed back to their families in Mexico - who are of course relatively helpless in doing anything about it through legal channels. And finally, virtually every other crime in Arizona has seen a drop-off in frequency, which further isolates the drug cartels as the root of any crime problems. So why not try exploring effective ways to deal with the specific issue of drug violence rather than a fundamentally flawed bill targeting all immigrants? Quote:
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#43
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Re: Arizona - WTF?
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I realize that the 'one kidnapping per day' stat is misleading, and that's the way it is in Mexico too, but it's not an excuse to just let it slide. Even if the kidnapees ARE involved with the druglords, it's not like they deserve to die; same with the illegals. Secondly, I do believe a lot of innocents are getting kidnapped and ransomed, because I've heard a lot of stuff firsthand. It's not as though Arizona is unsafe but I can see their tolerance for this sort of thing wearing thin. As for a drug-violence related bill; what do you propose? It's not like they haven't been trying to fight this for years... The all-or-nothing argument does apply to this bill, even if it doesn't really apply to the issue at hand which is immigration in general. We need to fix this system and deal with the problem up front instead of passing laws like this one; on that I agree. But given the absence of any type of immigration reform, I do understand a bill like this. Clearly the AZ government sees illegals as a problem, and I don't believe it's because "they hate Mexicans over there". Most likely because they do abuse our health care system and don't pay taxes (yes, I know that some do pay taxes). I know that many of them are just earnest, hard-working people that are good for our economy, but the question then is, why have the law at all? If I put on a blue jersey and started working at Wal-Mart without being hired would I not be arrested regardless of whether or not I was helping? Look, it's clear there's a problem here...70% of Arizonans support the law, and it's a clear mistake to just say "well, they're all uneducated and racist". And this is in a state with a huge population of Latinos! They're better educated than you think. |
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