that'll teach 'em...

[jole]

I am not just writing these things from the top of my head like u Rog.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_football

[matt]

Originally Posted by jole

Why the hell should Croatia have to be thrown out of the tournament, and what does Croatian FA has to do with racism?
I am not defending couple of complete idiots that were insulting English player on racial basis, but people that come to the stadium unfortunately have the liberty to say whatever they want no matter how stupid and ignorant it is, and no penalty will change that cause its not coming from that idiots pocket.

All the English Clubs were thrown out of European Club competitions a few years back because of a few idiot hooligans - a case of the minority ruining it for the majority - and I don't see how racist chanting is that different. It sometimes takes a harsh penalty where the majority suffer to force changes in attitude etc

[jole]

Not that different, and few idiot hooligans? Supporters in Heysel were charged for involuntary manslaughter, imo that is very different, bigger crime equals bigger punishment. And speaking of punishment its significant to say that it came from the FA not UEFA.
As i said before if Uefa or Fifa will punish that kinda behavior in every form it comes and in every country equaly we wouldnt be able to watch football since it s happening everywhere, so i think its better to find a way to punish the trouble making minority.

[Rog]

Originally Posted by jole

I am not just writing these things from the top of my head like u Rog.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_football

read the first part of this wiki thing mentioning in particular italy spain and eastern europe. the vast majority of these incidents mentioned were in club football not internationals so neither am i writing from the top of my head. In england since the turn of the millenium the only racist incidents have been virtually all player to player - not internationals - the same for holland belgium france. English players have been racially abused in 3 internationals in the last couple of years namely spain macedonia and croatia......end of

[chuck]

As a resident of the southern hemisphere - can I make this comment.

There's idiots in any sport. From dickheads who throw beer bottles at the ref in rugby, to fat Saffers who make it onto the field to tackle the ref.

Even this week - Spurs fans, still not over Sol Campbell leaving (wtf? that was 2002!) are being investigated for abusing him. Not sure if it was racial, or just standard ugly shit.

And yeah - European football - and I include England (same wikipedia link as previous post) has not exactly been covering itself in glory when it comes to their conduct in the stands.

Neither have the players. Di Canio's fascist salute antics anyone?

Football reflects the community that it's played in. As Gazza might be able to tell you - if the pie eating wally recalls - you're pretty stupid to insult the community that you're a part of. And it continues - as the comments here show.

From where I sit - it's not a matter of who's doing what and when. It's what you're going to do about it. The 'you' being - FIFA, UEFA - other fans in the stand, you as an individual if you witness it, the clubs, the players.

Coz it's bullshit really. And bickering over it doesn't make it any less bullshit. Regardless of what 'side' you're on.

[Tiger]

jole, i think people here while obviously disappointed a minority of croatian fans choose to abuse our black players rather than support your own team, we're actually more annoyed with uefa's pitiful fine. It doesn't send any message of deterent that racism won't be tolerated.

Believe me I can understand your frustration with a few mindless cretins ruining your country's reputation, we suffer it at every major tournament we attend. However rather than focusing your ire on people here perhaps it would be better served looking internally as to why it appeared socially acceptable for a vocal minority to make such chants at a football ground in 2008 and get away with it without being shouted down or kicked out.

oh and two final points, one do some proper investigation on the facts surrounding heysel before commenting, and secondly have you booked your flights for South Africa yet

[jole]

It is not socially acceptable and it was condemned by the press and the public but damage was already done.
As for Heysel i think my research was deep enough to dispute what was in my opinion a bad analogy. I took data from these sites: http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...00/2481723.stm, and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heysel_Stadium_disaster