Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Because..........

There are a few new UW tunes out there such as "Bamboo, Between Stars, Diamond Jigsaw, You Do Scribble" which are sounding very exciting and encouraging and is seen by some folk as a true return to form.

Whilst the RiverRuns are a source of new material, the problem is that they only really get out there to the hardcore UW fan. Plenty of casual listeners won't be aware of the stuff that is on there. Stuff like JAL and Lenny Penny are good songs that are hidden away.

I really think that if a new album was released with the above new songs on, it could propell UW back in to the mainstream again. Think about it, OWB didn't get any major radio/TV play. Singles weren't played on daytime radio, though supporters like Rob da Bank did give exposure.

The Prodigy returned this year and so far all there singles have been given major airtime on radio/TV, despite your opinion on how good you think they are. Even Royksopp got some press with there last effort. I can pretty much guess that when Massive Attack decide to come back, they will be given a lot of attention due to their reputation.

When AHDO came out, it premiered on Pete Tong and made daytime Radio 1 giving it a top 20 chart place, even Dino 3D got something as well. But OWB didn't which was annoying as there are songs on there which deservered mroe exposure.

In a nutshell, these songs on a new album could spark new life back in to UW if there ever released.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

How could you forget Always loved a Film? Good point though...they've definitely got at least one album of ace material stored up; they've never been as big as the Prodigy, but if they did have one album that got great reviews across the board, it could definitely bring them a lot of exposure...

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

"all these shit albums got attention and play, so if underworld make a really great album maybe they'll get that too"

what??

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Always Loved A Film, Strumpet, Between Stars, Diamond Jigsaw, Parc. Throw in You Do Scribble, Bamboo/Price collabs, a few ambient tracks and one or two others and you've got a killer album.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

NO WAY! Theres plenty of ambient tracks on the Breaking and Entering soundtrack thankyou ;)

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Why are you implying a cause and effect relationship there? Is this really too complex for you?

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

yeah, but what Underworld album doesn't have ambient tracks? it's part of their formula.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

yeah formula for me to skip ;)

Ansum - yes. Monkey Wank - no thanks :P

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

what the hell is wrong with you?

D0900 moans the lack of attention underworld's been getting, even noting how AHDO got more play than OWB did. mentions how prodigy and royksopp have been getting themselves out there and heard through various channels.

then: why dont underworld knock out albums to get themselves play like this?

easy answer is that they're shit albums with shit music for shit uses. none of them are making music like they used to, so that point is a bit of a non-starter, so we're left with "underworld should make a really great album out of all these bits so they get attention like prodigy and royksopp do"

which makes no fucking sense.

clear enough?

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

You're really arguing a stupid point, you know that?

Good albums get press. Especially now in the internet age. Nowhere did the OP say anything like "they should do it like Prodigy". They're not the Prodigy. They need help from the press, who saw OWB as sort of disappointing and without any real single material.

Maybe you need to go outside to vent all your pent up frustration and anger?

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Oh this thread is just a breeding ground for arguments...
Surprised nobody's complained about this:
yet. It's probably for the best that they haven't.
To say that Dirty0900 wants Underworld to make a "shit album" assumes that the albums he was using as examples of success were bad. Not once was that said, and it certainly wasn't the basis of the entire argument. Quite the opposite, in fact: by making albums full of singles that could easily get themselves "on air", those bands got them on the charts and therefore reached some level of popularity, which could then be used to build excitement for a future release. Underworld currently has a large back catalog of tracks like that, and releasing them together could help them "spark new life" into the group.
Now can we just put this to rest?

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

i know he never said those were shit albums, and i knew (obviously) that he wasnt telling underworld to make shit slbums. he even said flat out "whether you think theyre good or not"
however, i'm saying they're shit albums. so my understanding, based on the logic here, is regardless of quality they should follow the example of recent shitty albums and follow suit and provide single material and stuff that can be used for ridiculous purposes just to stay out there and popular.

which i'd be against.

please try again.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

As much as I don't want to start a flamewar, I'd hardly call promotion a "ridiculous purpose". Whether you want to accept it or not, "Underworld" is Rick & Karl's profession as much as it is our lovely art project with intricate poetry celebrating everyday moments. They need money. That doesn't mean they compromise their image to do so. It means they use the music they think will get them the most popular in their current 200+ library to do so. Think of it this way: they're fighting for more fans. Just as I'm sure half the Dirts here now used Nuxx as their entryway into fandom, future generations of Dirts will need something to get them started.
I'm sorry. I honestly am. There's no good reason for me to be arguing. But there's not a reason for you to be either.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Uhhh, top-tier albums by somewhat well-known artists do get lots of press. How many Radiohead songs do you hear on the radio or TV? When Sufjan Stevens sold out concerts across the country, was it because of the runaway success of "Jacksonville"? If they were bad albums, nobody would know about them today.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

try 'chicago'

a vast, huge majority of 'good albums' dont get press either, while sevral terrible albums do. getting play or notice may just not be worth the hassle of coming up with something suited to radio play. if underworld have it in them to make another 5 star album, then they dont need to think of football commercials to make it, they just have to make an album that isnt nearly as problematic as recent output's been showing.

however, this makes sense:
sure, but if it's not the album they want to put out, then it shouldnt be.

even though looking at the big picture it seems basically ridiculous to suggest how to get popular to a band that's been around some 25 years who's been-there-done-that.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

i would sell my dog for an album version of you do scribble.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

yes... i've had it with 'ambient tracks'. quiet is okay, ie: air towel, blueski, skym. ambient is boring. i didn't care for the last album for a few reasons, and one was the inclusion of ambient tracks. i know a lot of y'all were ranking the album very high when it came out, but now that the dust has settled it's clear that oblivion with bells was no 'second dubno' despite the black and white artwork.

as for more attention to our beloved artists dubman, i don't think our dirty friend was implying in any way that they should make a crap album with catchy beats and make tons of money and sell out. what he was saying is that they're releasing things in the wrong place, and i agree. check out 'you do scribble' and some of the tracks named above that have been around for a while. a lot of good stuff was released on the riverruns (in addition to a good degree of crap), and then when OWB comes out, we expect an album that'll be better than the online stuff and the live stuff they've been releasing, but what we get turns out to be a bunch of moody-ambient style tracks that are okay, but seem strange to be placed on an album when they've got better stuff that could be put on an album and brought into the spotlight by those bastards at pitchfork and rolling stone when it comes across their desk for a review. i don't think he's suggesting at all that underworld should sell out, and to be honest i think you know that, too. it seems like you're looking for a fight, but when it comes down to it, dirty900 is just a guy on a forum like you and me, and it's not like rick and karl are going to pull up this post and come to a revelation that they should make crappy singles and base their entire future in music on something someone wrote on dirty.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Uh, what the heck? Ansum = ambient. Monkey Wink, pretty much electro, sans beats. Put a beat on top (i've done it) and it's a regular Moaner 2.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

By the by, YDS, ALAF, and even Bamboo have been floating around in fairly finished forms for awhile now. yes, i know the argument in 2005-06 with the RiverRuns were that we'd heard snippets of the tracks on dirtyradio in 04, and for OWB, we got the Biro finally as Beautiful Burnout.
But in my view, the above tracks have served their purpose in the live arena and won't make it to an album or RR (if there is another). Just 2 cents.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

I think Rick's happy with his own dog.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Perhaps I am a bit out of line here but aren't Prodigy, Massive attack and Roykksop signed to labels if not major labels. I think the current consensus here is that AHDO fell short in a way. The tour associated with the album saw a lot less improv as well. I think the boys have responded to this as a product of Label pressure on both accounts and I for one believe them. This is the reason they branched out on their own, read independant. This is the reason OB got little to no airplay vs their contemporaries such as Prodigy etc. I think if you look at their current live show and where the level of improv is getting to and you look at the new stuff coming out I think we are in for a whole new era of Underworld. Be carefull what you wish for because if they boys do get popular again we may never here anything but a string similar festival type sets consisting of the hits and and the new. I for one would love to see them open up their catalog. Even my friends who have only seen them three times are complaining about the similarity in the sets. But my friends thats another topic for another thread.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Wow this spun out of control at an alarming pace...

All id say is that as a listener whether you realise it or not what will make you want to buy the music, is not a formula, its not a "sound" that a group like Underworld got famous on in the first place....
... and remember to use the examples of Prodigy's new album or Royksop's is a bad way to go about this.. if you are really going to talk about success you have to think how many people are going to KEEP buying an album for years and years... if i was to look at prodigy's new tunes in 3 years time id simply say "why buy that when i can buy Experience/Jilted Generation" - because everyone is simply saying "oh its a real return to form" because Prodigy (in my opinion) have taken no steps forward and simply made an album that sounds like the glory days...
...if underworld want "success" or new hoards of money they dont need to make an album like Beaucoup Fish, Dubno or Second Toughest - because it will simply be a flash in the pan before the media craze boils over and everyone thinks - "hmmm but this is like a bad Second Toughest"

In my opinion the only way any artist can really experience sustained success is to create an album which makes you say
"Fuck me ive never heard THAT before" - im sure all you have to do is think of the feeling you got the first time you heard Dubno - or the bass of Jumbo etc etc etc..

As we are all clearly very serious fans we are always going to really search for the brilliance in their new work.

I felt it in the first time i heard the Drums of You Do Scribble drop in and the synth rise gradually over the mayhem on the Palladium Recording from 2008 - that blew me away because it was like "who...what!?...fuuuuuuuck!" - i just didnt see it coming

But while i love the way strumpet sounds on the london recordings and Between Stars seems to have a similar sound - i am really wondering what they are going to do to these songs to make them really unique - if they can. Because while they are really good solid tunes - they are not going to be classics (not for me yet anyway)- the progressive bass lines and the chorus/verse/chorus construction of the vocals bring the music more into the realm of pop while the drum structure has devolved to something way simpler.. I think these songs have a long way to go before they really stand out...but i can see it happening. To me they just dont contain the multilayered dynamic aural stimulation that underworld bring to their finished products.

What i am saying is that all we have really heard of these new tunes are the bare bones - well at least i hope so... otherwise this is going to be a real new direction for underworld - and like many have said on the boards, it is starting to give a little more of the late eighties early nineties Underworld vibe, just as Dubno was coming along.
I think what it more reflects is the trends in pop music these days to be slightly more synthy and drum machine (La Roux for example)

Im rambling, and i have probably just fueled this fire like crazy....

I guess what i think would be great to hear is tunes like Between Stars and Strumpet with a treatment like what we have heard on "Moon on Water" where there seemed to be some real brilliance bubbling in the creative juices...

But anyway... if Underworld really want something to keep em going they need something that will sell for years rather than for months... and they wont do that by simply looking at what worked before for them and whats working now for others

they need to do something completely different

even if that means losing a few older fans on the way (but that shouldnt happen - because a good fan has an open mind)



I should really get some sleep

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Also THAT is an excellent point.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Not weighing in one way or another, but Prodigy is own their own label for this last album. I think they've gotten a fair amount of radio play with their singles (but I'm not sure; we have no radio in Hawaii).

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

you have no radio in Hawaii!?!?!?!? isnt that dangerous?

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Haha, I'm being a bit facetious. We have no radio worth listening to.

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Nah, it was an on purpous typo, i was being flippent not litteral sorry
for the confusion ;)

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

I thought he was dogless...

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

Underworld has done this before and will do it again, they have a whole catalogue of songs that they playout, test and repeat - very rarely will any appear on an album

yes i'd like some studio versions of these songs - perhaps via a similar limited 12" / download release like the river run remixes, but wishing every track that one of us has liked appears on the next album is pointless... we all like different styles and elements of tracks and some will make the cut and some won't

did Underworld not have, like 180 tracks or elements of tracks lined up before or around the release of OWB... UW has a lot of music in its back cat and archives - parts of it will still make it through to the album, but lets not try and sway (not that we could or will) the way Underworld work on their albums, after all they've made 7 fairly well themselves already, and if all is to be believed this next one is gonna be a cracker too...

keep up the good work, and don't listen to this lot... superfans are crazy mofo's :)

just as long as you do scribble is NOT on it i'll be happy :p

Re: Hope these new songs don't go on RiverRuns
 

I always thought of "Parc" as being a more 'traditionally'-structured song, as in it wouldn't be too weird to hear Depeche Mode or New Order or Thomas Dolby having done something like that. It was more New Wave and less 'UW-as-usual'. It's probably my favorite song they've done this decade. I don't have a problem at all with UW letting in pop influences. I think they are talented enough to figure out how to do it the right way.