Republican Convention

[Sean]

So I just watched Fred Thompson and some of Lieberman's speech (had to walk the dog). I can't help but feel disturbed by the Republican rhetoric, the inordinate focus on military pride, and even the people they keep showing in the crowd. The chants of "USA", and the thunderous applause for bald-faced lies are simply creeping me out. Saying that Obama is against funding the troops? Saying that he doesn't want to protect babies? As a centerist, it's no secret that I do support some conservative principles, but the behavior I'm seeing in this convention today is extremely disturbing.

[cured]

I fashion myself as a centrist, as well, and this is typical rhetoric to spew because a lot of viewers in the republican base can't really see through it. McCain voted against the benefits increase to the troops and supported the war that the heroes they portrayed were killed in.

Lieberman really let me down. I was expecting something with a little firepower and that speech nearly put me to sleep. I think it nearly put the crowd to sleep, as well.

The interesting bit, going back to what Sean was saying, was how Fred Thompson's attack wasn't on policy. Obama was attacked for being one of those evil liberals nobody can trust. I've noticed this isn't an attack policy the democrats have adopted. Deriding someone as a slimy conservative hasn't exactly been a staple of democratic rhetoric, the language has always taken a different form: warmongering, corrupt, "Good ol' Boy", special interest, out of touch with America. But playing the conservative card has a tendency to tick off the religious folk who the Republicans can say are safely on their side.

It's because they're stupid.

[kagenaki koe]

oh wow, i wasn't expecting to see the POW card story told again. and thanks for telling me that you aren't using this hurricane deal as a political feel good ploy. oh, and sarah is a darn great candidate. i can't wait for her to mention hillary's success in a non-pandering tone in the next few days.

[IsiliRunite]

I can't help but feel disturbed by the Republican rhetoric, the inordinate focus on military pride, and even the people they keep showing in the crowd. The chants of "USA", and the thunderous applause for bald-faced lies are simply creeping me out.
The conventions, like both parties platforms, are places for pedantic, unreasoned kool-aid sipping.

[kagenaki koe]

feels like a war rally.

[cured]

The speeches by Giuiliani and Palin were certainly critical of Obama but both wandered off into "not telling the truth anymore."

It'd be a mistake to focus on Palin, though...I'm pretty sure her ethics probe will do quite a good job of that.

[kagenaki koe]

hard to believe in the message of Reform....when most of the guys using the rallying cry look like the poster boys of The Good Ol' Boy's Network.

then you get to Miss Reform herself, who outside of metioning the actual word reform, really just parroted the same old party line.

[Sean]

The outstanding element of the whole night for me was the glaringly low-class on display. Such school-yard tactics. They're betting that there are enough uninformed people out there that their bs will work. They may yet be right, but I for one find that approach insulting.

[cured]

That's one of the problems I have with the GOP. Whatever they don't like, or even better, whatever they're threatened by, has them reverting from logical debate to scare tactics and name calling.

Palin built herself up, pity she has to go back to her own state and answer questions about firing the top cop in her state over a family dispute (I understand the trooper did have a not-so-awesome record but her staffers were evidently caught on tape making inquiries on behalf of the governor).

That's when she isn't answering questions about some of the falsehoods and hypocrisies she introduced and carried on in her speech.

[cured]

By the way, Sean, going negative is what got McCain to catch Obama in the polls. These next two months are going to be ugly.

[Deckard]

The outstanding element of the whole night for me was the glaringly low-class on display. Such school-yard tactics. They're betting that there are enough uninformed people out there that their bs will work. They may yet be right, but I for one find that approach insulting.
Things that struck me were the same things that always strike me about the Republican rallies/conventions - the sickening machismo (I'm reminded of that song in Team America, "AM-ER-IC-AAAAA.... FUCK-YEEEEAHHHH!"), the pandering to stupidity (to some extent both parties do this, but the right has traditionally excelled at appealing to the lower more primitive parts of the brain), and the positively chilling degree of patriotism - a concept which, at that level, seems to require putting reason on hold. (To me as a Brit, those enormous flags on screen just looked scary, in a fascist/ultra-nationalist foreign V for Vendette kind of way!)

Schoolyard tactics is right. In particular, they're remarkably similar to that of the schoolyard bully who rules by force/machismo and fear, and scoffs at reason. If you're not in his tribe, you're a target.

[cacophony]

Schoolyard tactics is right. In particular, they're remarkably similar to that of the schoolyard bully who rules by force/machismo and fear, and scoffs at reason. If you're not in his tribe, you're a target.
and this has won them 8 years of executive control so i'd call it a pretty successful tactic. sadly.

i'm so extremely disappointed in mccain. i realize he doesn't control the overall party, and i realize he'd never be in a position to vie for the presidency without the party's support. still, in his entire career he was never THAT GUY. now he's letting the party steer him towards ugly tactics and manipulative messages in order to get the base out.

i know it's become fashionable for democrats to view mccain as the enemy, to describe him as old (LOLZ) and senile (SUPERLOLZ) and a direct carbon copy of bush in his policymaking. but the truth is, that's not the case and we all knew it before all of this turned so negative. he used to be a better politician (and better person) than this, but because the stakes are so high he's allowing himself to become twisted and exactly like the thing he's always stood apart from.

before all of this, if mccain had won the election i wouldn't have been bothered. now i find the prospect fairly upsetting.

the RNC has marked some of the most depressing days of 2008.

[Deckard]

^^ Agree, agree and agree.

[cacophony]

CNN.com's homepage headlines are not terribly flattering about the impression the RNC has made so far. Stark contrast to the analysis and reactions to the DNC.

one excerpt: (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/04/rnc.analysis.wednesday/index.html)

For the second consecutive night, a lot of the rhetoric at the Republican convention Wednesday evening seemed left over from the last cycle when the fight against terrorism dominated the race.

The biggest voter concern and the theme of the evening was the economy. But did it top the agenda Wednesday night? No. The policy prescriptions were minimal; the party-issued signs proclaiming "prosperity" made for a jarring sight.


The language and terror focus were left over from 2004. The evening's tone was vintage 1992, with just a hint of culture war.
Surveys suggest Democrats hold the advantage on the dominant issue this year, so Republicans looked to redirect the anger with base-pleasing swipes at the media and liberal elites.

[cacophony]

oh my god, i will never stop laughing.

the mccain camp is unable to define palin's "executive experience." (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYYiw_y2qDI)

[Sean]

And a fantastically sarcastic article in Politico about why the media "should apologize" to Palin (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13143.html). An excerpt:


ST. PAUL, Minn. — On behalf of the media, I would like to say we are sorry.

On behalf of the elite media, I would like to say we are very sorry.

We have asked questions this week that we should never have asked.

We have asked pathetic questions like: Who is Sarah Palin? What is her record? Where does she stand on the issues? And is she is qualified to be a heartbeat away from the presidency?

We have asked mean questions like: How well did John McCain know her before he selected her? How well did his campaign vet her? And was she his first choice?

Bad questions. Bad media. Bad.

[gambit]

What the fuck. Did anyone see that "9/11 Tribute" video they played? Why didn't the narrator just say "John McCain will protect us, and that radical muslim terrorist Barack Hussein Osama bin Laden will kill us all"?

[jOHN rODRIGUEZ]

and this has won them 8 years of executive control so i'd call it a pretty successful tactic. sadly.

i'm so extremely disappointed in mccain. i realize he doesn't control the overall party, and i realize he'd never be in a position to vie for the presidency without the party's support. still, in his entire career he was never THAT GUY. now he's letting the party steer him towards ugly tactics and manipulative messages in order to get the base out.

i know it's become fashionable for democrats to view mccain as the enemy, to describe him as old (LOLZ) and senile (SUPERLOLZ) and a direct carbon copy of bush in his policymaking. but the truth is, that's not the case and we all knew it before all of this turned so negative. he used to be a better politician (and better person) than this, but because the stakes are so high he's allowing himself to become twisted and exactly like the thing he's always stood apart from.

before all of this, if mccain had won the election i wouldn't have been bothered. now i find the prospect fairly upsetting.

the RNC has marked some of the most depressing days of 2008.

Whatever the outcome for McCain in this Presidential Election, I believe McCain knows how to handle "them". He was clearly the best choice for
The Republican Party.

I find myself getting a bit red in the face questioning who's behind the possible set up. And who would stoop so low.

[kagenaki koe]

John McCain just named his Axis of Evil : Al-Qaeda, Iran, and The Evil Russian Empire (led by Darth Putin). and then transitioned to how he hates war. then briefly make mention of The Cold War.

ooohkay.......

[gambit]

He spent all of three minutes talking about what he was going to do as president and the rest patting himself on the back.

[cured]

Hey guys, did you hear that John McCain was a POW?

[dubman]

Abortion: I'M A WAR HERO
American principles: I'M A WAR HERO
Civil rights: I'M A WAR HERO
Cylons: I'M A WAR HERO
Disabilities: I'M A WAR HERO
Economy: I'M A WAR HERO
Education: I'M A WAR HERO
Energy: I'M A WAR HERO
Environment: RIG IT HOWEVER
Ethics: I'M A WAR HERO
Family: BANG MORE YOUNG BITCHES
Fiscal: I'M A WAR HERO
Foreign Policy: I'M A WAR HERO, AND I'LL BOMB THE GOOKS-ER, RUSSIANS... UM. WHATEVERTHEFUCK

Gun Control: I'M A WAR HERO
Health care: I'M A WAR HERO
Homeland Security: I'M A WAR HERO
Immigration: I'M A WAR HERO
Iraq: I'M A WAR HERO
Monogamy: I'M A WAR HERO
Political Experience : I'M A WAR HERO
Poverty: I'M A WAR HERO
Prostitution: I'M A WAR HERO
Rural: I'M A WAR HERO
Service: I'M A WAR HERO
Seniors & Social Security: I'M A WAR HERO
Technology: I'M A WAR HERO
Use of the I'M A WAR HERO
Veterans: I'M A WAR HERO
War Heroes: I'M A WAR HEROhow the fuck does crashing yr fkkn plane and spending years in a prisoner camp make you a hero. you sat it out and took it like a bweeb because you couldnt do fuck else. did you get hassled in a war camp for america? jesus

[chuck]

Daily Show - Day 3 of the RNC (http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/index.jhtml?episodeId=184082)

Superb.

Moments of zen galore.

Nuff. said.

[dubman]

Daily Show - Day 3 of the RNC (http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/index.jhtml?episodeId=184082)

Superb.

Moments of zen galore.

Nuff. said.
wow, that was pretty relentless and unusually energized.
i bet part of them kinda wants mccain to win. just a bit.

[Sarcasmo]

how the fuck does crashing yr fkkn plane and spending years in a prisoner camp make you a hero. you sat it out and took it like a bweeb because you couldnt do fuck else. did you get hassled in a war camp for america? jesus

Too far, dude. Too far. First off, there's a big difference between being shot down and crashing. Second off, he could have gotten a great deal of good treatment if he'd just said what they wanted him to say and did what they wanted him to do, which was trash his country on the radio and TV for them to play all over Vietnam and anywhere else they could have circulated it. So, yes, he did get "hassled for america."

Yes, he's playing up his experience in Vietnam, and he's dropping his POW card anywhere he possibly can, but what he went through should not be open to ridicule. 99% of the population on this planet would have been reduced to gibbering idiots if they went through what he has.

I hope you were drunk when you typed this, because it's a shit post.

[cacophony]

Too far, dude. Too far. First off, there's a big difference between being shot down and crashing. Second off, he could have gotten a great deal of good treatment if he'd just said what they wanted him to say and did what they wanted him to do, which was trash his country on the radio and TV for them to play all over Vietnam and anywhere else they could have circulated it. So, yes, he did get "hassled for america."

Yes, he's playing up his experience in Vietnam, and he's dropping his POW card anywhere he possibly can, but what he went through should not be open to ridicule. 99% of the population on this planet would have been reduced to gibbering idiots if they went through what he has.

I hope you were drunk when you typed this, because it's a shit post.

agreed 150%

you don't have to like his policies or automatically believe his experience as a POW qualifies him for the presidency. but for chrissake don't ever disrespect what POWs go through. you insult him and you insult every single one of them.

it is possible to respect his experience without being obligated to vote for him.

[dubman]

i hate using this as fallback, because wine simply lubricates the umbrage, it doesnt *create* outrageous statements, but yes i was quite in the red that night. i also swore i'd finish my portfolio that night too, which is impossible, and i was actually helpful in the main forum

but eh, i stand by it in a curmudgeonly way. cant pretend i actually respect POWs to begin with just because they "went through" things. if i did i'd be lying and playing politics. they were stuck in the shittiest situation imaginable and now that it's done he gets to exploit it as an election stump and receives multiple "get out of gaffe free" cards. fuck him, i'll make fun of it all day then. he also basically got peer pressured into saying that torture is okay now. okay i shouldnt speculate too hard about why he'd endorse treatment put upon him but is this war hero crap not 97% opportunism at this point? i'm not taking it seriously anymore because i dont think he is.

[kagenaki koe]

john stewart said it best "hey, Guantanamo Bay isn't a prison, it's a Leadership Academy!"

[cacophony]

...but is this war hero crap not 97% opportunism at this point?

yes it is. but the way i see it belittle the man, not the experience. if he wants to make small of it by exploiting it then that tells you the measure of the man. but it shouldn't affect the gravitas we all should feel when pondering what it means to be a POW.

[kagenaki koe]

the POW card, cheapening the experience:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmQDn_DLjCQ

[dubman]

the experience is only as respectable as the one who lived through it. i'd have much more of it for someone in mccains situation if they didnt use it as a reason why getting captured is a reason to get elected.

if someone goes through hell and becomes a miserable asshole for it, i'm not going to care what part of them i make fun of, because they're a miserable asshole. if someone comes out of it and does some good out of it, whether personally or outwardly, thats a much harder thing to do and is actually respectable.

but all this just elaborates on the simple idea that i dont give a damn. belittling isnt exactly the most grownup sport in the world, why stop at faux-pas.

[kagenaki koe]

funny stuff about one of the background images during McCain's speech:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/213806.php

[dubman]

i like the idea of a political convention being the next idea for christopher guest.

a lot.

[potatobroth]

I wondered what that building was.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13860_3-10033827-56.html

The predominant assumption in the blogosphere is that one of the AV geeks tasked with backdrops for the evening's speech was told to get a photo of Walter Reed Army Medical Center, but got my middle school instead. Weird thing is, as pointed out by Talking Points Memo (http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/09/mccains_speech_backdrop_was_us.php), the lead blog on the still-developing story, Walter Reed Middle School was also the backdrop for Matt Santos' announcement of his presidential candidacy on The West Wing. (Another Hollywood factoid: the show Head of the Class was also loosely based on Walter Reed Middle School's Individualized Honors Program.)

[kagenaki koe]

diligence in reasearch (or vetting) doesnt seem to be a republican strong suit.

[cacophony]

oh man that's too good to be true.

[kagenaki koe]

new Daily Show (post Palin Speech)

http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/index.jhtml?episodeId=184093

"Fck You Community Organizers!"

[kagenaki koe]

fast forward to the 5:10 mark of the clip, John McCain nicklebacks Bush's 2000 election acceptance speech:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=184111&title=john-mccains-big-acceptance