underworld equipment?

[polar_action]

out of nothing but interest can anyone enlighten me as to what techno gear uw use for their live setups and that lovely beacoup blue desk......

i know that there is some macs and ableton live cause we saw some screen grab piccies before.... but any definitive thingy?

:rolleyes:

[lloyd]

You hear the Nord Lead a lot. That's one of the things that get people hooked to underworld.
I think that if you do a search you'll see that there are some topics about the equipment underworld uses on this board.
The pics were from the Prague concert and still can be found here http://www.skylineweb.cz/underworld/underworld.html

[Dirty0900]

Man, thats a pretty impressive set up:eek:

[Jan]

The Nord Lead is also mentioned in this article:
http://www.dirty.org/underworld/articles-uw.php?id=29

Akai MPC2000XL (x6!)
Akai S2000
Akai S3000
Akai S5000
Apple Mac running Logic (PowerBook laptops for live work)
ARP2600 (x2)
Boss CR-78
Clavia Nord Lead
Moog MultiMoog
Novation BassStation
OSCar
Roland JD-800
Roland Juno 106
Roland R-8
Roland TB-303
Roland TR-909
Roland VP-330
Yamaha CS1x (x2)
Yamaha DX7
Guitars
I'm wondering where they used the TB-303...?

[botkiller]

i've always wondered this myself, it was one of my major questions when UW would do shows and we could ask questions, etc.... on everything, everything it seems like they're running a big rack of effects gear, as you see Karl fooling with it a lot when he's doing vocals, etc.

I can tell in those pics quoted above that they're using ableton live, which has been getting increasingly more popular as of late.

I always wondered how it was that they did all the live mixing, I've not had the chance to see the boys live, but with the big mixing board in front of them it seems like they're running tons of signal and bringing it in and out as they wish.

I just keep telling myself that someday, someday, I'll see them live in another format than the dvd.

[lloyd]

They don't have that rig Karl used anymore, it contained (if my memory dosn't fail me) 2 akai samplers, some vocal FX + a channelstrip and a cdplayer. Now Karl has his own part of the mixingdesk + some gadgets and the pioneer cdplayer with the big jogdail on top. That's where those nice vocal samples come from :)

[Céj]

that blue mixing desk is a Midas Heritage 1000 (link (http://www.midasconsoles.com/midas03/heritage1000.htm))

i think the songs are still played with 2 synced iMacs with Logic and they only use ableton for smaller samples and loops

[King of Snake]

yeah I think that's about it. They used to run all the streams/loops from AKAI S5000 or 6000 samplers live, triggered by MPC's, but they switched to using direct 24 bit 48 Khz audio from the computers.
There's a Nord Lead in the livesetup, and two Quasimidi technox modules and of course a Roland TR 909. No TB303 in the live setup, but you can hear 303's being used on some of UW's early records.

There's a good article about the technicalities of the liveshow over here (http://www.dirty.org/underworld/articles-uw.php?id=2)

[verbal]

Anyone know what's on the screen of the Mac on the left? The one with the large counter on it.

Also, I'm curious how they use the mixing desk with Live. Is the desk midi and Live just has all the parts ready for Rick to trigger? Are parts programmed very basic in Live and Rick has the main controls?

[Renze]

I think I saw an Access Virus C (?) in an Underworld pic once. I think it was a pic of Karl's home studio (?)

[lloyd]

Pic of the mixingdesk for the venue sound + a living legend working it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/allert/62971240/

[Céj]

Anyone know what's on the screen of the Mac on the left? The one with the large counter on it.

Also, I'm curious how they use the mixing desk with Live. Is the desk midi and Live just has all the parts ready for Rick to trigger? Are parts programmed very basic in Live and Rick has the main controls?

the mixing desk is audio, but i think there's some sort of midi controller mounted above the desk to trigger the samples in Live, which then sends the samples as audio to the desk

for the actual songs they use Logic not Live, i think one song in each of the 2 main Mac's and all the audio send to the desk so they can mix these songs, for example at i love techno i think something was wrong with one of the main Macs, so there was no more mixing and quite some time between 2 songs because Rick had to load the next song in the same Mac as the previous song

[King of Snake]

Anyone know what's on the screen of the Mac on the left? The one with the large counter on it.


Looks like Logic on the left mac and Live on the right + laptop.

[lloyd]

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/dec00/articles/underworld.asp
This is the old gear, info in the orange collum about karls rig

[phaseblue]

`Anyone know what's on the screen of the Mac on the left? The one with the large counter on it.
It's definitely Logic Audio! Funny/great how much you can customise that software's interface and it's environment. Best thing since sliced bread! To this day, I still say f@#k Cubase!!! Cakewalk has always been the underdog so I always respect them too - have only heard positive things about Sonor!

[verbal]

the mixing desk is audio, but i think there's some sort of midi controller mounted above the desk to trigger the samples in Live, which then sends the samples as audio to the desk

for the actual songs they use Logic not Live, i think one song in each of the 2 main Mac's and all the audio send to the desk so they can mix these songs, for example at i love techno i think something was wrong with one of the main Macs, so there was no more mixing and quite some time between 2 songs because Rick had to load the next song in the same Mac as the previous song

Looks like there's a lot more on the Live screen than just a few samples. I'd like to know more about how they're doing it.

A good guess could be that Live handles loops and Logic handles the rest. :shrug:

[lloyd]

Time for a open doors day at Lemonworld!

just kidding, part of the underworld magic is that we don't know I think

[mmm skyscraper]

2 turntables
a microphone

[King of Snake]

`
It's definitely Logic Audio! Funny/great how much you can customise that software's interface and it's environment. Best thing since sliced bread! To this day, I still say f@#k Cubase!!! Cakewalk has always been the underdog so I always respect them too - have only heard positive things about Sonor!

You can customise Cubase too you know. All this software has overall the same capabilities anyway, it just depends on what you're used to. I've never used Logic but I hear a lot of people find it's interface hard to master and onLOGICal. I use Cubase SX myself and like it a lot. It's certainly not without it's faults though. (too many bloody windows!)

[Renze]

Ableton Live FTW. It's a matter of personal preference though, I like non-linear pattern based producing over linear Cubase-style producing.

[stimpee]

I've never used Logic but I hear a lot of people find it's interface hard to master and onLOGICal.But hasnt Logic been Macintosh only for three years now? I thought it was stuck at v5.5 on the PC (when it was eMagic). The Mac version is on v7.1 Pro i believe. No idea how much the interface has changed but with Apple taking over, they have a reputation for working on the UI.

[King of Snake]

correct, it's been bought by Macintosh. I don't know anything about Logic since I never worked with it, I'm only saying that from what I heard, its interface isn't always the easiest to work with. I'm sure if you're used to it you won't notice or mind.

[phaseblue]

I'm only saying that from what I heard, its interface isn't always the easiest to work with.

That is true KoS! It's a VERY deep sequencer and does take some time (and patience) to get your head around. I guess the most attractive and powerful feature is Logic's "Environment" window. You can virtually route audio and midi in almost any way imaginable. But, when it comes to midi, Logic is second to none! There are people who have made LFO's and midi delays in the Environment to control outboard instruments that don't have those features/effects. You can even make virtual software controllers (with knobs and faders) in the Environment that control their real life counterparts. It really is an amazing piece of software!

BTW - Wasn't trying to insult anyone's tastes (or Cubase itself) by the "f#&k Cubase" comment! Just having fun! It's like the Mac vs. PC debate. Everyone has their own preference. Actually I used Cubase for a bit about 8 years ago before finally settling on Logic. I liked Logic then (and even now) for it's ability to customize nearly everything - especially MIDI! But nowadays, with everything turning towards VST and software instruments, they are basically all very much the same! They just have different interfaces!:)

Matt

[Floating Dave]

I love Logic but Apple need to think about the effects of their endless changes to spec if they're going to keep real-world users on-side. Making music shouldn't involve us in making political decisions and that's where Ableton are stealing a march - Good, inspirational tools backed up by people who care about what they do and who will listen to users

(I don't work for Ableton and I still use Logic ;) )

There's some more Underworld gear pics here http://www.flickr.com/photos/12614642@N00/page3/

[King of Snake]

That is true KoS! It's a VERY deep sequencer and does take some time (and patience) to get your head around. I guess the most attractive and powerful feature is Logic's "Environment" window. You can virtually route audio and midi in almost any way imaginable. But, when it comes to midi, Logic is second to none! There are people who have made LFO's and midi delays in the Environment to control outboard instruments that don't have those features/effects. You can even make virtual software controllers (with knobs and faders) in the Environment that control their real life counterparts. It really is an amazing piece of software!

BTW - Wasn't trying to insult anyone's tastes (or Cubase itself) by the "f#&k Cubase" comment! Just having fun! It's like the Mac vs. PC debate. Everyone has their own preference. Actually I used Cubase for a bit about 8 years ago before finally settling on Logic. I liked Logic then (and even now) for it's ability to customize nearly everything - especially MIDI! But nowadays, with everything turning towards VST and software instruments, they are basically all very much the same! They just have different interfaces!:)

Matt

hehe, no harm done. I've heard the Logic VS Cubase debate before on various audio forums. It can indeed get as heated as a PC VS Mac discussion :)
I'm using Creamware Scope DSP cards system, which has completely free midi/audio routing environment like you describe. It's very nice. I can route all my Cubase channels via ASIO to the DSP environment, and any external signals (Nord Rack and electric guitar) and pretty much send anything anywhere I want, using DSP fx and mixers on the way. VERY flexible.
Also, in Cubase I use a plugin called ERA (http://www.sonicbytes.com/era/era.htm) which is basically a midi-stepsequencer but also does arpeggios and lots of other cool midi stuff, so that nicely adds to the midi functionality already there in Cubase. I can use that to control my VSTi's, or my Nord Rack synth, then route the Nord's audio into the DSP environment and run it trough a bunch of fx before recording back into Cubase....easy :)
I think you can also make these "virtual software controllers" in Cubase, although I've never used that feature (since I only have one hardware synth).

[King of Snake]

I love Logic but Apple need to think about the effects of their endless changes to spec if they're going to keep real-world users on-side. Making music shouldn't involve us in making political decisions and that's where Ableton are stealing a march - Good, inspirational tools backed up by people who care about what they do and who will listen to users

(I don't work for Ableton and I still use Logic ;) )

There's some more Underworld gear pics here http://www.flickr.com/photos/12614642@N00/page3/

hey those are some great pics! Hadn't seen those before, so thanks for sharing :)

[undarrenworld]

Thanks for the photos and info.

I have now Ableton Live 5.02 and its really great program...;)

[lloyd]

Thanks indeed for the pictures. I LOVE gear pics :)
But the picture of Karl at wembley stadium (1991?) is great too.
quote out of an old interview (http://www.obsolete.com/convulsion/interviews/convulse/4.20.html):
So I did that in 1991(playing with Debby Harry). It was a great tour, because we were touring with Iggy Pop, Sisters of Mercy and Billy Idol sometimes. We did that thing with INXS at Wembley stadium. I got my dad down just so I could say

"I played Wembley dad, sorry it's not football but it's the best I could do."

[undarrenworld]

Thanks indeed for the pictures. I LOVE gear pics :)
But the picture of Karl at wembley stadium (1991?) is great too.
quote out of an old interview (http://www.obsolete.com/convulsion/interviews/convulse/4.20.html):
So I did that in 1991(playing with Debby Harry). It was a great tour, because we were touring with Iggy Pop, Sisters of Mercy and Billy Idol sometimes. We did that thing with INXS at Wembley stadium. I got my dad down just so I could say

"I played Wembley dad, sorry it's not football but it's the best I could do."

Which link shows uw in 1991?

[lloyd]

Creative surfing my boy ;)
http://static.flickr.com/15/68302577_79c460e2a2.jpg?v=0

[undarrenworld]

Creative surfing my boy ;)
http://static.flickr.com/15/68302577_79c460e2a2.jpg?v=0

Yes, thx mate, its cool.

[Floating Dave]

Thanks indeed for the pictures. I LOVE gear pics :)
But the picture of Karl at wembley stadium (1991?) is great too.
quote out of an old interview (http://www.obsolete.com/convulsion/interviews/convulse/4.20.html):
So I did that in 1991(playing with Debby Harry). It was a great tour, because we were touring with Iggy Pop, Sisters of Mercy and Billy Idol sometimes. We did that thing with INXS at Wembley stadium. I got my dad down just so I could say

"I played Wembley dad, sorry it's not football but it's the best I could do."

And it'll probably come as no surprise that Karl made every show special on that tour with his boundless energy and general all round good vibes. From the moment the lights went up he was brilliant - and this is coming from a jaded old tour cynic ;)

Here's another couple of pics I just found in the archives: http://www.flickr.com/photos/12614642@N00/

[lloyd]

Having watched the Underneath the Radar videoclip, I can imagine how that would have looked like. Without the ponytail then ;)
Keep digging in that archive dave! :)

[polar_action]

great pictures dave. thanks for sharing.


another dave. :eek:

[lloyd]

Some more nice info, in hungarian.., of the tour gear.
http://ezone.techno.cz/kb.php?mode=article&k=46

[change]

Thank all you guys for sharing your knowledge and pics. I hope to get back into making music again soon myself and need to be schooled on what's the "in" gear. Does anyone know how Karl gets that gloriously rich guitar sound in Ess Gee? Looks like he plays mostly Les Pauls, but what else does he play through to get that warm, moist sound? Er... pardon the bad choice of words.http://www.dirty.org/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[DaddyAdv]

As we heave heard before, Kenton UK were working closely with Rick to solve some Problems by custom-built MIDI-Boxes.
Sonicestate just posted a nice pic and infos about Rick's main switching box that sits on top of the Midas desk, the other boxes and Karl's wireless Guitar-to-MIDI system. Quite interesting if you're into MIDI / sequencing:

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=5529

[m.g.]

Some more nice info, in hungarian.., of the tour gear.
http://ezone.techno.cz/kb.php?mode=article&k=46
Erm... that's in Czech... ;)

[lloyd]

yehiknow

I think I got confused because there were very nice pictures taken on stage of all equipment at the hungarian concert.

[King of Snake]

Thank all you guys for sharing your knowledge and pics. I hope to get back into making music again soon myself and need to be schooled on what's the "in" gear. Does anyone know how Karl gets that gloriously rich guitar sound in Ess Gee? Looks like he plays mostly Les Pauls, but what else does he play through to get that warm, moist sound? Er... pardon the bad choice of words.http://www.dirty.org/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

of course it's not about what "in" but about what suits your working method best. The've mentioned working with incredibly expensive microphones at Abbey Road, but at the same time, the vocals for Jal To Tokyo were recorded with a macbook's built-in mic. So it's hard to say what type of equipment they used for which particular sound. It's all about experimentation. Sometimes the oldest most broken down piece of gear may just give you "that" sound that you're after.